Tuesday, March 15, 2011
We got your transit stops right here — and your poll
The poll was taken for the Regional Transportation Alliance — judge accordingly, but the questions seem reasonably straightforward. Traffic congestion is NOT the number one concern in the Triangle. That said, three out of four favor a rail-transit system for commuting and/or a combination of rail and better-bus transit. More than half are even prepared to pay for it via a 1/2-cent sales tax for transit. (That last figure dropped from almost 57 percent to barely 51 percent when the ante was upped to 3/4-cent for better transit AND schools.)
‘‘Nearly 60% of voters in the western Triangle counties of Durham and Orange would be willing to support a half-cent sales tax to improve transit offerings,” said Paul Fallon of Fallon Research and Communications of Columbus, OH. “While the support is conceptual since the respondents were not reacting to a specific package of bus and rail investments, that is still strong support given the ongoing sluggishness of the economy and the presence of the existing temporary sales tax.”
(More from the RTA below the fold.)
Triangle Transit is holding public forums (workshops) beginning next week to explain its latest thinking and get public input on what a regional transit plan should look like and where it should go. The forums are part of a process required before the TTA can apply for federal funding under the New Starts grants category. The schedule for the forums is here.
I kept hearing that the new plan would have more station stops than previous plans. Yup. I count 16 in the Orange-Durham corridor, some of which would be potential stops for a Bus Rapid Transit system rather than light-rail stops. In the Wake light-rail corridor plan, 20 stops are listed.
A possible Durham-Wake commuter-rail scheme running from downtown Durham to a station at Greenfield Parkway, southeast of Garner, would use some of the same stations as the light-rail system, but not all of them.
* commuter-rail = less frequency, moves faster, fewer stations, service mainly at rush hours;
* light-rail = greater frequency, moves slower, stations every mile or so, service at all/most hours;
I was told that this list is subject to change right up to the first forum — and may well change later as a result of the forums. With those caveats, here t'is:
Potential Rail Stops: Triangle Regional Transit Plan
Orange-Durham corridor: (looking at BRT and LR)
Stations:
• UNC
• Mason Farm
• Hamilton
• Friday Center/Meadwomont/Woodmont
• Leigh Village Station
• Gateway
• Patterson
• MLK
• South Square A or B
• LaSalle
• Duke Medical
• 9th St
• Durham
• Buchanan
• Dillard
• Allston Ave
Wake LRT Corridor: 18 miles, 20 stations, 15 vehicles, 29-32 mph ave, 34-41 minutes travel time, 4350 park and ride spaces, 51 bus bays
Stations: (about 1 mile apart, all on the NCRR corridor)
• Cary Parkway
• NW Maynard/Cary
• Downtown Cary/Depot — shared w/commuter and Amtrak
• NE Maynard
• West Raleigh (just east of I 40, NC 54) — commuter rail and large park and ride
• Jones Franklin/Western
• State Fairgrounds
• Gorman/Hillsborough St./Meredith College
• NCSU/Dan Allen
• NCSU/Pullen Rd. - commuter rail
• West Morgan St.
• Downtown Raleigh — commuter rail too; 2 alternatives: follow Morgan St. to Harrington St or West St. (will operate as a streetcar for about 1/3 of mile, where cars can travel along with LR) OR go over Boylan St. Bridge (creating a Union Station w/ high speed rail) OR going towards South St/Amtrak station and then north up Salisbury
• Government
• Peace St. (paralleling Atlantic)
• Whittaker Mill
• Six Forks/Atlantic Ave.
• New Hope Church Rd (between Atlantic and Old Wake Forest Rd)
• Millbrook Rd.
• Spring Forest
• Then either to NE Regional Station (where 540 goes over rail corridor) OR to Triangle Town Center (big park and ride)
(Boylan Bridge — until agreement reached with railroad, have to show only option of a bridge OVER Boylan Bridge, but hope to go under it)
Durham-Wake Commuter Corridor: (looking at commuter rail; some overlap with LRT stations)
37 miles, 12 stations, 15 vehicles, 43 mph ave., 51 min travel time, 4400 Park and Ride, 40 bus bays
Stations: from Durham to Greenfield Parkway southeast of Garner
From the RTA:
Regional Transportation Alliance, March 2011 Transit Poll Results Released
High support for transit, including expanded rail and bus services, throughout all three counties
Nearly 60% of Durham, Orange voters support sales tax; Wake numbers down slightly but still above 50%
RDU AIRPORT, NC — The Regional Transportation Alliance business leadership group released the results of its most recent transit poll this afternoon. This is the third RTA poll since the approval of long-range transit plans by our region’s two metropolitan planning organizations for transportation in 2009. Area chambers of commerce provided significant funding for this cooperative poll on public transit.
‘‘Nearly 60% of voters in the western Triangle counties of Durham and Orange would be willing to support a half-cent sales tax to improve transit offerings,” said Paul Fallon of Fallon Research and Communications of Columbus, OH. “While the support is conceptual since the respondents were not reacting to a specific package of bus and rail investments, that is still strong support given the ongoing sluggishness of the economy and the presence of the existing temporary sales tax.”
“Although Wake County has dropped slightly since 2010, support for the sales tax remains above 50%,” Fallon noted. “If gas were to increase to $4/gallon, more than 20% of voters said that that would make them more likely to support the tax to improve transit options.”
Joe Milazzo II, PE, RTA Executive Director, stated that “While the support for the tax has gone down slightly in both Orange and Wake, the support for a sales tax remains above 50% in all counties, with overall support for transit as a benefit near 80% regionwide,” said Milazzo.
Travel to Research Triangle Park was the top destination for Wake voters, with travel between counties the second choice. Travel between counties was listed first by both Durham and Orange respondents.
If forced to choose between expanded bus or rail systems, Orange and Durham voters supported an expanded bus network while Wake voters focused on enhancing rail. Regardless of their preference, more than 75% of voters in all counties felt that they will benefit from enhanced public transit.
See the table below for a comparison of support for a sales tax for transit over time. For more information on this poll or past polls, visit letsgetmoving.org/poll. The RTA will continue its series of community feedback initiatives during the coming months as the region explores transit options.
Support for 1/2c sales tax for transit in Triangle: Results over time
Durham County
2011 59.7 For, 33.6 Against, 6.7 Unsure
2010 58 For, 41 Against, 2 Unsure
2009 52.2 For, 45.9 Against, 2.0 Unsure
Orange County
2011 59.2 For, 37.6 Against, 3.2 Unsure
2010 61 For, 35 Against, 4 Unsure
2009 56.6 For, 37.4 Against, 6.0 Unsure
Wake County
2011 51.0 For, 45.1 Against, 3.9 Unsure
2010 55 For, 41 Against, 4 Unsure
2009 50.5 For, 46.7 Against, 2.8 Unsure
The margin of error is +/- 3.26 percent on a regionwide (n=900) basis, and +/- 5.7% on a county-by-county (n=300) basis. Fallon Research and Communications supervised the poll.
Comments (7)
Showing 1-7 of 7
Thanks, Eric -- for those who don't know him, Eric Lamb is the city staff's go-to transportation guy.
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Bob:
Thanks for this synopsis. Regarding long-range transit planning, I think you're going to see a more complete picture begin to emerge during TTA's upcoming meetings.
Morgan Street as a streetcar-type alternative isn't out of the picture, but it's a lot more difficult than we originally thought relative to the cross-section, the vertical design parameters, and how the train physically leaves the street and enters the station.
Orulz, i think the approach you've outlined for a downtown loop is on the table, but there are some major pros & cons that come along with it. There are still big bridge elements associated with this option with regards to transitioning into and out of the rail corridor on each end. You also have to remove all the on-street parking, which may not go over real well with some folks.
Even with signal priority, a route through the center of downtown has more stops and is a lot longer. The tradeoff is considering either more R-Line style bus circulator service from Union Station around downtown, or exploring something like a fixed-route streetcar system using the Salisbury/Wilmington loop.
But all of this is exactly the type of thing that TTA needs to hear from the public about. I hope you'll make time to attend the meetings next week and provide your feedback.
Speaking of high speed rail, any word on what has become of the NC4 alternative? To me, it was a stroke of brilliance, but it's almost guaranteed that the exact citizen-designed plan would be impossible to implement in real life. Hopefully, they did not reject it again out of hand for being "not invented here" at the first sign of difficulty, but instead put some serious effort in and found out what would actually need to be done in order to make it work. If SEHSR really wants zero grade crossings in Raleigh, "NC4" or something like it is the probably the only alternative that the city and citizens of Raleigh will be able to stomach.
This needs to be considered alongside a system of downtown circulator buses or streetcars and in the context of whatever the high-speed rail solution is supposed to be. Incredibly, 20 years into transit planning in the Triangle and there's still no consensus about how transit is supposed to work in the Capital City of Raleigh -- which says something about the city's leadership.
By the way, catching up on yesterday's in-box and came across this on the Raleigh Downtown Living Advocates site:
http://www.raleighdla.com/home/2011/3/14/w…
IMO, just going straight down Morgan Street to the Capitol Building and turning north from there doesn't really cut it either. That still leaves a walk of over half a mile to get to Memorial Auditorium. It's a nice walk down Fayetteville Street to be sure, but it's still over half a mile.
Since a picture is worth a thousand words, here is one possibility that attempts to combine the best of all alternatives, at the likely expense of somewhat longer running time.
http://www.tinyurl.com/downtown-lightrail
Good question why the Morgan Street alternative seems to have disappeared east of West or Harrington streets. To me, this is the obvious way to go, bringing the light rail line out of the big RR corridor right below Charlie Goodnight's -- where the corridor is at-grade with Morgan Street -- and shooting it Downtown from there.
A bridge over the Boylan Avenue bridge seems like an odd solution unless you're in Singapore (that's an attempted joke), where everything's built on multiple levels.
Let's see if we can get a response from officialdom.
I'm not really happy with the two downtown Raleigh alternatives. So several of the alternatives will serve Union Station and Glenwood South directly, but they leaving a minimum half mile walk to Fayetteville Street and a ONE MILE walk to the southern part of downtown (Performing Arts Center and Convention Center). Anything that leaves a ONE MILE walk to the convention center should, in my opinion, be dropped.
The other option hugs the railroad tracks to South Street, and then goes up Salisbury, which will do a great job of providing access to the core of downtown, but it leaves a longer walk from the light rail to Union Station, and an even longer walk to Glenwood South. This alternative also leads to complicated, expensive, and potentially ugly long bridges and tunnels for crossing the railroads and Boylan Avenue.
Neither alternative seems ideal to me. Why can't we take the best aspects of each and combine them into a "super-" alternative?
(1) Run trains on-street (in dedicated lanes, with signal priority) on Morgan, providing the best connections to both Union Station and Glenwood South, while also eliminating the need for costly, long, and high bridges over the tracks (Morgan Street already bridges over the tracks.)
(2) Also run trains on-street (again, in dedicated lanes, with signal priority) along South/Salisbury/Wilmington, directly serving the core of downtown.
Link them together with a route next to railroad tracks from Morgan to South. Best of both worlds. The downside? Slightly longer travel time through downtown. This might add a minute - at most two - when compared to the existing Salisbury/Wilmington option.
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