Thursday, April 21, 2011
Food truck operators still fighting for a place in Raleigh as restaurant owners try to defend turf
Mike Stenke parked his Klausie's Pizza food truck on the corner of Dawson and Hargett streets, just across the street from the Avery C. Upchurch Municipal Building on Tuesday night and handed out two pizzas worth of warm, gooey bite-sized free samples to build favor for proposed zoning changes that would allow him to regularly operate in the city.
John and Karla Schriner of Knightdale each bought a shirt with a picture of a food truck and text reading, “Legalize It.”
“It’s a lot harder for them to get permits here,” Karla said. “A lot of good food trucks stay in Durham and don’t ever come here. It’s just a culture that’s kind of cool, plus you’ve got to support your local independent business no matter what.”
- Photo by Joe Schwartz
- Raleigh resident Dusty McCraven grabs a free slice from Klausie's Pizza owner Mike Stenke prior to Tuesday's Raleigh City Council meeting. McCraven sports a shirt supporting changes that would allow food trucks to operate in the City of Oaks.
“He seems like the kind of guy who is at the forefront of this and really a leader,” McCraven said. “I hope it really works out for Raleigh. We need it. It’s a scene.”
Inside City Hall, elected officials were considering text amendments that would allow trucks to park on private lots provided that they have permission from the owners and that they are 50 feet away from eateries. The public hearing stirred the debate between mobile food operators, both existing and aspiring, and brick-and-mortar restaurant owners, who cried “unfair competition.”
The proposal also would require food truck proprietors to safely dispose of waste and grease each day and does not allow for signage or audio amplification.
“I want to applaud the City Council for the great work they’ve done working toward this proposal,” said Stenke, who has been pushing the council since September to draft rules to allow food trucks.
“It goes a long way toward making a level playing field.”
But several restaurant owners such as Alex Amra of Tobacco Road said the field isn’t level as long as truck owners don’t have to pay rent.
“I love competition,” he said after the hearing. “But I love competition that has the same overhead and bills I do.”
Niall Hanley, who owns Hibernian Irish Restaurant and Pub on Glenwood Avenue, said that restaurants can be just as creative and artistic as food trucks and says allowing the mobile vendors in the city will stifle small restaurants from opening up.
Two McDonald’s operators argued that their locally-owned franchises would see a decrease in business if food trucks were allowed in the city and would have to lay off workers. A pizza shop owner said she built her business model on late-night sales and said food trucks would cripple her.
Their arguments didn’t appeal to Jonathan Lubekcy, a Raleigh resident and military veteran.
“I fought for this country. I like freedom. It’s really simple. It really bothers me when I hear people standing up and saying, ‘We want to ban these entrepreneurs because we don’t like competition,’” Lubecky said. “There’s a simple solution to competition—build a better product.”
Food truck operators contend that they provide a low-cost startup opportunity for aspiring restaurant owners, create jobs in a slow economy and contribute to a worldwide growing culture of quick, diverse and festive street food that can bring visitors and attract attention to Raleigh.
And it doesn’t have to be a case of either or, Lubecky added, noting that though he occasionally craves greasy pizza from a food truck, he will continue to dine at established restaurants.
Steve Valentino, who serves Italian fare at Valentino’s Food Truck, pledged to restaurant owners that he would not park in front of their businesses; rather, he urged a creative compromise, perhaps providing a discount to customers who purchased food from the restaurant earlier that day.
“If you could see the amount of money I made for a lunch or a dinner, you would laugh,” he told restaurateurs.
“That money goes back into some more supplies, gas that keeps going up. If the truck breaks I’m out of business. If it rains I don’t make any money, and with the rest of money that I have, I take my beautiful wife out to dinner at your restaurant. … We can work together on this.”
Two dozen folks either spoke or attended to support the food trucks compared to one dozen who sided with the restaurants.
The debate now moves to the Planning Commission, which has 30-45 days to make a recommendation to the City Council. Mayor Charles Meeker urged the two sides to work together to find a compromise.
Stenke lamented that it has taken six months to get to this point and that he’ll have to wait longer to partner with coffee shops and breweries that wanted him to park his truck in front of their businesses and attract customers. Still, he said he hopes to work with his opponents to make sure they create a “fair and reasonable” solution.
“As long as there are rules in place and those rules are enforceable, I think it’s going to be a great thing for the city,” he said.
Comments (8)
Showing 1-8 of 8
Bill,
I think you misunderstood my point about fair competition and the laws being rewritten. Restaurateurs would have the ability to operate a food truck just as Klausies etc. does IF they really felt this was an area they needed to compete in. I don't like the B&M's argument of inequality, because they'd have access to the same business model IF they wanted to do it. I personally feel like Tobacco Road shutting its door in lieu of a food truck is an empty threat, and if not there will be another entrepreneur eventually willing to take over the space and realize the potential. I think the food trucks serve a different market, and for most establishments the sales hit would be minimal. Now that would be an unfortunate downside, but nonetheless capitalism.
Bada Bing? I have no way of knowing what their ROI is for a slice of pizza. I do know that you'd need to quantify a lot more than ingredients and leasing costs, but that's a different argument. Either way there are no absolutes. I agree that this type establishment has a little more stake in the game, but the last time I checked Glenwood Ave. wasn't full of Bada Bing Pizza style establishments and no one wants that for downtown anyway.
A different comparison would be Mellow Mushroom... is Klausies really going to eat their lunch? When people have a hungry party of six and want a few drinks with dinner they're not going to line up at Klausies.
I agree that the foodies need to be more organized and bring better arguments to the table to support their fight, I hope they can do that. I just don't think that the B&M's are putting forth anything significantly better, they just already have the law on their side.
The food trucks need more privilege, but I don't believe they should be allowed to go wherever they please. Whatever plan the city does come up with needs to be well thought out and regulated so that everyone can coexists (and not necessarily in the same space). They've got to make some changes though, the current laws just don't fit in with being industrialized, and they certainly don't represent democracy, capitalism, and a free market.
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I don't know Dub, but they tend to set up in Durham in areas where there aren't many options for eating (like down by Full Steam and Motorco). Not really a good comparison to trying to set up along Glenwood Avenue and Fayetteville Street.
I'd be curious to here what the owner of Kings Sandwhich Shop and the soon to be Open Geer Street Garden think about food trucks being set up near them and how it impacts their business. If they support the trucks it would be wise for the food truck vendors to tap them for support. Why that approach hasn't been taken is a shock to me. Durham is pretty cool but they have their own problems that can't be solved by food trucks alone.
Why are food trucks allowed in Durham? Have they decimated Durham's restaurant scene? Also, why is Durham so much cooler than Raleigh? Why does Raleigh always have to be lame?
Troy -
I disagree that if the rules were rewritten the trucks abd B&M would be able to compete in the same way. The trucks would pay a nominal fee to operate downtown while the hoops and costs the B&M places face are much more significant. I don't beleive your assumption that the B&M stores get a better return on their investment either. Is there a reason you think Bada Bing Pizza makes more profit per slice than Klausie's pizza does per slice? That is a flawed arguement.
Your point about the B&M stores being off as food trucks is well taken. That is exactly what the guy from Amra's meant when he said if the ordinance passes he would close his restaurant and open up a food truck because it is cheaper. I'm sure the city council would be thrilled. Who wouldn't want to see all that empty retail space in their downtown. Why open up a shop if your better off with a food truck. Pretty sure that is not the message the city wants to send to people looking to invest in downtown. As the guy from Solas pointed out - maybe next time he should look to open his next restaurant in a location like Brier Creek, North Hills, or Cameron Village where he wouln't have to deal with food trucks. Again, not the message the city council wants to send. These arguements don't help the food truck vendor's cause and actually hurt it. It's too bad the food truck vendors didn't come in to the meeting last week having already met with restaurant owners to try and work out their differences.That was the wrong time to have that conversation. I think if they had met ahead of time that would have gone a long way and given the city council something to grasp onto to justify moving forward. By not meeting ahead of time the food truck vendors handed the council a perfect excuse to delay.
Bill, I would imagine the problem with recruiting brewery owners is that they rightfully don't want to choose sides in the fight considering they'd like to keep tap space in those brick and mortars.
I didn't attend the meeting so I can't speak to how well (or not) things were organized on behalf of the food trucks, but I don't see some of the arguments from the restaurateurs as logical. Equity? If the law was rewritten, they'd be able to compete the same way. You're right that restaurant owners have to invest far more in a B&M than a food truck owner has to in his business, but the returns on those investments I imagine are far better as well. If the odds are so heavily in favor of the food trucks, why wouldn't they just invest in their own?
This is a case where the market should be able to dictate what happens. If people want food from a truck, why should the government block that? It's also a tiring example of how some people always want less government in their lives UNTIL it benefits them.
Food trucks are just another "vehicle" for delivery (pun intended). Internet sales Vs. B&M sales is a good example. In the internet era, you either have an online presence, or operate so well that you coexist without it. Businesses need to evolve in order to be self-sustaining, we don't need social programs or entitlements for restaurants.
There's a place for both guys in this fight and I'm personally routing for them both to be around a long time. I hope they can come to a compromise that works for everyone.
I was at the meeting. The Food Truck operators did a terrible job making their points and appeared very disorganized. Kind of surprising given they have known about this meeting for months. I think they would be better served by planning what they want to say in advance of future meetings and coordinating with each other so they don't all say the same thing. One truck operator after another stating how food trucks add diversity and appeal to the creative class will only get them so far.
FWIW, I support the food trucks but am dissapointed how they disparage the restaraunt owners on the facebook pages. The owners aren't against competition - I think they would glady compete with a rival restaurant that opened up shop across the street or next door to them. The restaurant owners main arguement is equity. They are required to invest 100's of thousands if not millions in property improvements per the city. Then they are required to pay higher property taxes on those improvements. That is just one example of the hoops they have to jump through to bring a new business to downtown Raleigh. Where as the food trucks aren't required to do much more than apply for a couple 100 dollars worth of permits. I don't think Valentino's comments about wanting to "test" a site for his food truck before being required to buy a permit helps the food truck arguement either.
The restaurant owners concerns over trucks parking within 50' of their place is valid too. Where were food trucks 10 years ago when Glenwood was a ghost town? It seems now that others have spent millions revitalizing the area the trucks are conveinently popping up and willing to mooch off others efforts. It is also not very helpful to listen to current food truck vendors make empty promises how they will not park by restaurants. The ordinance isn't just for the 20 or so vendors the currently exist - it is for ALL FOOD TRUCKS that will come down the pipe in the future. I like Mike Stenke and Valentino, but they don't speak for all food trucks and they can't make promises about how future food trucks will behave. Will there be 2 trucks set up 50' away or 25? That is a good question and not one addressed by the new text.
Frankly, I am surprised the Food Truck vendors haven't already reached out to the restaurant owners to work out their difference. Remember, it is the truck operators who need the text changed, not the restaurant owners. I was also shocked they didn't bring reps from businesses like Big Boss and LoneRIder to speak to how food trucks have helped them. Or bring people from businesses who support the trucks. They food truck people are simply not doing all they can to be effective with their arguement and it is showing in that the ordinance language was bounced back into committee.
The Food Truck operatora need to get better organized and do a better job making their points. Right now they are good at getting press and have public support on facebook but are failing where it counts. They need to bring clear concise arguements supported by facts and numbers to provide to the committee. It is a shame that at the last meeting the best speaker with the most clear arguements was an owner of a McDonalds.
I expected a better showing from the food truck operators and they owe it to themselves to get their act together.
I cannot wrap my head around WHY these restauranteurs have their panties in a wad over food trucks. To me, it's like comparing apples to oranges.
Hi, this is Mike of Klausie's. I want to give a shout out to the guy who came up with the "Legalize It" T-Shirt. His name is Jeff Mcfadyen. Thanks Jeff!!
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